They were not outmaneuvered, they just surrendered of their own free will. No doubt the donors on Wall Street are pleased, since that is the only group Chuck Schumer listens to.
With all due respect he did not. He's doing the Schumer Two Step, he voted against it while orchestrating the capitulation. I am incandescent with rage. My healthcare premiums are mortgage payments already.
Shaheen is saying he was in the loop. So if he opposes it he also was unwilling or unable to stop it and his MO in the past has always been to focus on Wall Street as a win. At this point you may be right that he does not like it but as caucus leader he either has to shape the policies to his liking or get the hell out of the way for someone who can.
K. Starling shared this about the 4 that might be open to changing to no.
These eight senators voted “Yes.” Call and tell them to vote “No.” Sources have indicated that Kaine, Rosen, Shaheen, & Hassan may be open to voting “No” on the second vote.
It looks like surrender because that’s what it IS. And the fact that we get to blame Lucy when she inevitably yanks the football away AGAIN doesn’t do SHIT for the people whose premiums are going to cost more than their mortgage, Which, guess what, is going to raise costs for ALL OF US.
The eight picket line crossers didn’t do anything more than provide cover for the rest of the feckless cowards in the Democratic caucus. Know how I know? Because NOT ONE of those eight is up for re-election in 2026. Tim Kaine (D-VA) voted to surrender, reasoning that Virginia has a heavy number of federal workers. Mark Warner (D-VA)? Voted to hold the line. The difference? Warner is up for re-election next year.
Now MAYBE the Republican calculus is that “we dodged a bullet, and if premiums skyrocket because we didn’t extend the subsidies, then were gonna get blamed, so maybe we shouldn’t do that”. This very sensible logic will hold for precisely as long as Fat Donny Two-Times is distracted by picking out swatches or blowing up boats and not thinking about ACA subsidies. But if Russell Vought whispers in his ear that Congress might undo part of his Big Bag of Bullshit, or he realizes that this will throw a political lifeline to congressional Dems, he’ll thumb smash a directive to knock that shit off NOW, and they’ll do it. Constituents be damned, because Dear Leader told them to.
This is precisely the kind of thing that made me quit the Party in 2014. And it looked like they might have found their collective testicles for a brief shin gin moment, but no. they’r the same feckless surrender monkeys they always were.
If the shutdown continued for another week or two or three, into Thanksgiving, the assumption here seems to be that Trump would get the blame, he would force Republican Senators to eliminate the filibuster and/or restore the health care subsidies. In the meantime, hungry children, unhappy Thanksgivings and 20%+ canceled flights would be merely collateral damage. I am not convinced. Outrage at both parties for the shutdown and the brokenness/dysfunction of Congress is real. I favor cutting off the salaries of members of Congress during shutdowns. Guaranteed, there would never be another one lasting 5 weeks.
While I agree with you generally I have to disagree vehemently on this point:
"The shutdown is not going to have much affect on the overall political environment heading into the midterm elections. Most people won’t remember it happened a few months from now. However, it could reshape Democratic politics. "
Speaking as someone who went door to door for Harris and had to sell her despite her empty literature that talked up "bipartisanship" as if people wanted it (noone I met did), I can say this will affect the elections. This self-inflicted defeat will demoralize younger voters and will drive them away from the Democrats, or even from voting at all. It will also energize Republicans who see their talking points validated and Trump looking strong. When I talked to voters about Harris and local Dems they absolutely recalled events like this precisely because they were so big. They used events like this to shape their sense of the party's strength and willingness to fight, and this loss will sting.
For a brief moment it looked like the Democratic party cared enough about people to fight for their healthcare over donors, over Wall Street, over everything else. Then they caved. They took the results of a winning election and caved in the name of "bipartisanship", and really for the sake of Wall Street. People, particularly low information and younger voters will remember this and all Democrats will pay the price in lost volunteers, lost energy, and lost trust. Perhaps 2026 will still be a wave, but that will be despite the Democrats' best efforts, not because of it.
Doing what our Party's leaders are good at: Clutching defeat from the jaws of victory. The same Party that effectively kicked David Hogg out of the DNC leadership for saying that any Dem in elected office who lacks the backbone to fight for our side should be primaried. Enough already! Reelect Nobody. Clean house elect only people who will fight for the working class values that made the Democratic Party strong.
Thomas, we all better hope and pray that Roy Cooper isn't like our northern neighbor, Virginia, US Senator Tim Kaine. Virginia has swung around the polls from red to blue from its Governor, Lt. Governor, and Attorney General to the major party leading either houses of the VA General Assembly. In 2021, Terry McAuliffe elbowing himself ahead of the two more popular black women Democrats Jennifer Foy and Jennifer McClellan with the assistance of former Richmond mayor Stony Levar, which led to Glenn Youngkin and his black handmaid Winsome Fears and the clown Jason Miyares as POC props.
North Carolina are basically Virginia, but 5-10 years behind, here. I will demand that if Cooper gets the US Senate seat that we hold him fully accountable to fully support progress not capitulation to the regression regime. Otherwise, Cooper will find a set of new adversaries from this state. I will stay hammering on him like a pair of drumsticks tapping on a snare drum and cymbal set. Kaine is a former governor of Virginia like Cooper is here in NC. Kaine is so entitled and indebted to his white privilege and protected class position while knowing Virginia is hard hit by the federal shutdown.
This is also why NC Democrats need to learn from Virginia's mistakes since its solidified purple state status since 2008. NC needs to get either an egalitarian-minded, progressive white or black egalitarian who fights like hell for progress elected to all future statewide positions whether it is a state constitutional office or one of the 2 US Senate seats.
Virginian by birth, current NC resident. This is exactly right. Cooper is a good man and a gifted politician and we need every seat we can get in the Senate. But we need fighters, and not the pathetic Schumer versions. I truly hope Cooper can be that for us.
I can assure you that I will absolutely remember the hateful eight’s cowardice in caving to the GOP in exchange for empty promises. As will millions of others whose ACA health insurance premiums have doubled and in my case more than tripled. I’m disgusted by the Dems caving yet again and squandering the small bit of leverage they had. It’s clear those senate dems who caved are listening more to their donors than to the people who won elections for them less than a week ago.
Not just the eight. None of them are up for reelection in 2026. These are the designated villains. And any Democrat who continues to support Schumer after this has tipped their hand that they are in on it.
Yeah, I think Angus King was right. The deal wasn’t going to get any better, and as travel was further disrupted and those getting SNAP benefits struggled more and more, the pressure to make a worse deal would have grown. The Dems got back pay for workers and a moratorium on layoffs. Plus, there will be a Senate vote on the ACA subsidies in December. If it becomes law, that’s a win. If the House blocks it, or Trump vetoes it, you have a concrete issue for the midterms. Also, the filibuster remains. Still, being in a legislative minority sucks.
But they already had a concrete issue. The ACA premiums were already going to rise. Exacting this pain and folding does not change that. All it does is give the Republicans something to crow about and Democrats something to sting.
Chuck Schumer, that sage Democratic elder. The guy who proclaimed in the summer of 2016 “For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.”
The guy who, a year later on the morning after dinner with Trump at the White House, boasted to a hot mic that “He [Trump] likes us. He likes me, anyway” believing that Trump’s word could be banked.
And my personal favorite- with a local twist- Chuck Schumer, the Democratic elder from Brooklyn, New York who hosted then North Carolina Representative Brad Miller in his Senate office in the summer of 2007. Brad, a Fayetteville native, was contemplating a Senate run and Schumer headed the DSCC. He wasted no time in lecturing Brad on "how to win in the South”. It was a hot, muggy day and Brad was wearing a blue searsucker suit, a style he had appropriated from a grandfather who was nicknamed “Coon”.
Schumer is where he is because of his ties to wealthy, elite Democratic donors: Wall Street, pro-Israel, corporate interests. He is not where he is because of his impressive political or leadership chops. He is no LBJ, and he certainly has been no match for his nemesis Senator Mitch McConnell.
Brad decided not to run after that meeting with Schumer. I’m damn sure that Brad would have won that race, and that he would most likely still be serving North Carolina in the U.S. Senate today. We would all have been fortunate. But Chuck Schumer knew better.
Trump was never going to allow his vassal senators to negotiate or compromise. Massive suffering is what MAGA wants. It was and is inevitable whether or not the Democrats "caved." To dream that continuing to hold out was going to lead to a new age of bi-partisan cohabitation resulting in happy Democrats is a waste of time. Now, when things get bad beyond our imagining, Americans will have no doubt who is to blame and who tried to stop it. Blame the right people and continue the fight.
Looks like a loss , talks like a loss..... Surprise, it IS a loss. Outmaneuvered by the likes of Trump? God help us all!
They were not outmaneuvered, they just surrendered of their own free will. No doubt the donors on Wall Street are pleased, since that is the only group Chuck Schumer listens to.
All the stories I read said Schumer opposed this new deal
With all due respect he did not. He's doing the Schumer Two Step, he voted against it while orchestrating the capitulation. I am incandescent with rage. My healthcare premiums are mortgage payments already.
Shaheen is saying he was in the loop. So if he opposes it he also was unwilling or unable to stop it and his MO in the past has always been to focus on Wall Street as a win. At this point you may be right that he does not like it but as caucus leader he either has to shape the policies to his liking or get the hell out of the way for someone who can.
K. Starling shared this about the 4 that might be open to changing to no.
These eight senators voted “Yes.” Call and tell them to vote “No.” Sources have indicated that Kaine, Rosen, Shaheen, & Hassan may be open to voting “No” on the second vote.
https://open.substack.com/pub/thepeopledissent/p/immediate-actioncall-today
This is a good discussion about what still can be done too (today and so forth). Eliza Orlins lays out:
https://www.instagram.com/reel/DQ3KNQoAPY6/
Also a catchy new IG post on the 8 capitulators!
https://www.instagram.com/p/DQ4NN7KDZJu/
As a long-time Virginian, I am a Tim Kaine fan but I must say I’m disappointed.
It is beyond comprehension that those Dem senators caved. For what? The people got nothing in return.
It looks like surrender because that’s what it IS. And the fact that we get to blame Lucy when she inevitably yanks the football away AGAIN doesn’t do SHIT for the people whose premiums are going to cost more than their mortgage, Which, guess what, is going to raise costs for ALL OF US.
The eight picket line crossers didn’t do anything more than provide cover for the rest of the feckless cowards in the Democratic caucus. Know how I know? Because NOT ONE of those eight is up for re-election in 2026. Tim Kaine (D-VA) voted to surrender, reasoning that Virginia has a heavy number of federal workers. Mark Warner (D-VA)? Voted to hold the line. The difference? Warner is up for re-election next year.
Now MAYBE the Republican calculus is that “we dodged a bullet, and if premiums skyrocket because we didn’t extend the subsidies, then were gonna get blamed, so maybe we shouldn’t do that”. This very sensible logic will hold for precisely as long as Fat Donny Two-Times is distracted by picking out swatches or blowing up boats and not thinking about ACA subsidies. But if Russell Vought whispers in his ear that Congress might undo part of his Big Bag of Bullshit, or he realizes that this will throw a political lifeline to congressional Dems, he’ll thumb smash a directive to knock that shit off NOW, and they’ll do it. Constituents be damned, because Dear Leader told them to.
This is precisely the kind of thing that made me quit the Party in 2014. And it looked like they might have found their collective testicles for a brief shin gin moment, but no. they’r the same feckless surrender monkeys they always were.
Yes. The fact that they took an election win and turned to spit in our faces guarantees that people will feel this for a long long time.
If the shutdown continued for another week or two or three, into Thanksgiving, the assumption here seems to be that Trump would get the blame, he would force Republican Senators to eliminate the filibuster and/or restore the health care subsidies. In the meantime, hungry children, unhappy Thanksgivings and 20%+ canceled flights would be merely collateral damage. I am not convinced. Outrage at both parties for the shutdown and the brokenness/dysfunction of Congress is real. I favor cutting off the salaries of members of Congress during shutdowns. Guaranteed, there would never be another one lasting 5 weeks.
While I agree with you generally I have to disagree vehemently on this point:
"The shutdown is not going to have much affect on the overall political environment heading into the midterm elections. Most people won’t remember it happened a few months from now. However, it could reshape Democratic politics. "
Speaking as someone who went door to door for Harris and had to sell her despite her empty literature that talked up "bipartisanship" as if people wanted it (noone I met did), I can say this will affect the elections. This self-inflicted defeat will demoralize younger voters and will drive them away from the Democrats, or even from voting at all. It will also energize Republicans who see their talking points validated and Trump looking strong. When I talked to voters about Harris and local Dems they absolutely recalled events like this precisely because they were so big. They used events like this to shape their sense of the party's strength and willingness to fight, and this loss will sting.
For a brief moment it looked like the Democratic party cared enough about people to fight for their healthcare over donors, over Wall Street, over everything else. Then they caved. They took the results of a winning election and caved in the name of "bipartisanship", and really for the sake of Wall Street. People, particularly low information and younger voters will remember this and all Democrats will pay the price in lost volunteers, lost energy, and lost trust. Perhaps 2026 will still be a wave, but that will be despite the Democrats' best efforts, not because of it.
This is spot-on. Establishment Dems are GOP in blue hats. Primary every last one of them.
Doing what our Party's leaders are good at: Clutching defeat from the jaws of victory. The same Party that effectively kicked David Hogg out of the DNC leadership for saying that any Dem in elected office who lacks the backbone to fight for our side should be primaried. Enough already! Reelect Nobody. Clean house elect only people who will fight for the working class values that made the Democratic Party strong.
Thomas, we all better hope and pray that Roy Cooper isn't like our northern neighbor, Virginia, US Senator Tim Kaine. Virginia has swung around the polls from red to blue from its Governor, Lt. Governor, and Attorney General to the major party leading either houses of the VA General Assembly. In 2021, Terry McAuliffe elbowing himself ahead of the two more popular black women Democrats Jennifer Foy and Jennifer McClellan with the assistance of former Richmond mayor Stony Levar, which led to Glenn Youngkin and his black handmaid Winsome Fears and the clown Jason Miyares as POC props.
North Carolina are basically Virginia, but 5-10 years behind, here. I will demand that if Cooper gets the US Senate seat that we hold him fully accountable to fully support progress not capitulation to the regression regime. Otherwise, Cooper will find a set of new adversaries from this state. I will stay hammering on him like a pair of drumsticks tapping on a snare drum and cymbal set. Kaine is a former governor of Virginia like Cooper is here in NC. Kaine is so entitled and indebted to his white privilege and protected class position while knowing Virginia is hard hit by the federal shutdown.
This is also why NC Democrats need to learn from Virginia's mistakes since its solidified purple state status since 2008. NC needs to get either an egalitarian-minded, progressive white or black egalitarian who fights like hell for progress elected to all future statewide positions whether it is a state constitutional office or one of the 2 US Senate seats.
Virginian by birth, current NC resident. This is exactly right. Cooper is a good man and a gifted politician and we need every seat we can get in the Senate. But we need fighters, and not the pathetic Schumer versions. I truly hope Cooper can be that for us.
Kaine? What a weasel.
I can assure you that I will absolutely remember the hateful eight’s cowardice in caving to the GOP in exchange for empty promises. As will millions of others whose ACA health insurance premiums have doubled and in my case more than tripled. I’m disgusted by the Dems caving yet again and squandering the small bit of leverage they had. It’s clear those senate dems who caved are listening more to their donors than to the people who won elections for them less than a week ago.
Not just the eight. None of them are up for reelection in 2026. These are the designated villains. And any Democrat who continues to support Schumer after this has tipped their hand that they are in on it.
The Ds are Charlie Brown to the Rs Lucy. They think they will be able to kick the ball this time, but everyone else knows how this will end.
Look, how many angry and annoyed people do you want over the holidays. That’s not good either
Yeah, I think Angus King was right. The deal wasn’t going to get any better, and as travel was further disrupted and those getting SNAP benefits struggled more and more, the pressure to make a worse deal would have grown. The Dems got back pay for workers and a moratorium on layoffs. Plus, there will be a Senate vote on the ACA subsidies in December. If it becomes law, that’s a win. If the House blocks it, or Trump vetoes it, you have a concrete issue for the midterms. Also, the filibuster remains. Still, being in a legislative minority sucks.
But they already had a concrete issue. The ACA premiums were already going to rise. Exacting this pain and folding does not change that. All it does is give the Republicans something to crow about and Democrats something to sting.
Chuck Schumer, that sage Democratic elder. The guy who proclaimed in the summer of 2016 “For every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin.”
The guy who, a year later on the morning after dinner with Trump at the White House, boasted to a hot mic that “He [Trump] likes us. He likes me, anyway” believing that Trump’s word could be banked.
And my personal favorite- with a local twist- Chuck Schumer, the Democratic elder from Brooklyn, New York who hosted then North Carolina Representative Brad Miller in his Senate office in the summer of 2007. Brad, a Fayetteville native, was contemplating a Senate run and Schumer headed the DSCC. He wasted no time in lecturing Brad on "how to win in the South”. It was a hot, muggy day and Brad was wearing a blue searsucker suit, a style he had appropriated from a grandfather who was nicknamed “Coon”.
Schumer is where he is because of his ties to wealthy, elite Democratic donors: Wall Street, pro-Israel, corporate interests. He is not where he is because of his impressive political or leadership chops. He is no LBJ, and he certainly has been no match for his nemesis Senator Mitch McConnell.
Brad decided not to run after that meeting with Schumer. I’m damn sure that Brad would have won that race, and that he would most likely still be serving North Carolina in the U.S. Senate today. We would all have been fortunate. But Chuck Schumer knew better.
Trump was never going to allow his vassal senators to negotiate or compromise. Massive suffering is what MAGA wants. It was and is inevitable whether or not the Democrats "caved." To dream that continuing to hold out was going to lead to a new age of bi-partisan cohabitation resulting in happy Democrats is a waste of time. Now, when things get bad beyond our imagining, Americans will have no doubt who is to blame and who tried to stop it. Blame the right people and continue the fight.
From Matt Yglesias:
https://open.substack.com/pub/matthewyglesias/p/13-thoughts-on-the-end-of-the-shutdown?r=2jzc3&utm_medium=ios
I’m also a fan of filibuster reform, but that wasn’t on the table. It was either keep it as is or scrap it.